Would the ability to have instant membership to NHSA when joining a club be a help?

[rivercat 119]

Hello all, it seems we have a few "emergencies" for membership every year when it SNOWS,,,,, now why would that be? Anyways ,, how much of an asset would it be to pay for your club membership, print a paypal reciept and go register your sled all in the time span of an hour? Also having the instant online membership would decrease the time at the counter when registering if your already a club member. The club would still send the NHSA cards and stickers etc... Thoughts anyone?

[WINNOCTURN 60]

Hello all, it seems we have a few "emergencies" for membership every year when it SNOWS,,,,, now why would that be? Anyways ,,

We know why, because they left the damm application on the kitchen counter since September and it's January 3rd and there is a foot of snow on the ground.

how much of an asset would it be to pay for your club membership, print a paypal reciept and go register your sled all in the time span of an hour? Also having the instant online membership would decrease the time at the counter when registering if your already a club member.

Would not you have to spend the time online to fill out the Club Application Form? So what would the difference of just going to a local Registration Agent that has your Club's application available right there and will take your application and Club dues. We have three "Agents in Moultonboro the have our applications. Between them they processed over 175 Club Applications last season.

I (and my Wife Cheryl) do the Memberships For MSC. Depending on when some one mails their application and the time we receive it can end in a scenario we have the application but by the time we process it and mail the Cards the weeked they want to come up, Register and ride does not work. If someone calls or E-mail with an emergency, What I will do is send them an e-mail with a note for the Registration Agent with the NHSA Membership Number stating this person is a Member in Good Standing of both the Club and NHSA. I have never had any of the three local Agents the club recommends refuse this format.

The club would still send the NHSA cards and stickers etc... Thoughts anyone?

Edited August 27, 2010 by WINNOCTURN

[Pantera99 0]

Great idea Rivercat... think you mentioned it before someplace ... I take it your Talking about being a Member of NSHA membership & Card ???

A "Good" point would be the "Lesser Amount" of Paper work entailed, and go "Electronic"... But wouldn't this go against the theory of getting Registared Early ?.. or "New" to the sport individual's waiting for that 3-4 foot snow storm to spend money to registar their snowmobiles & join a club early ?

many Club's are doing Club Membership's on line already ... I maybe "wrong" (did I sat that?)but you have to be a member of a registared Snowmobile Club with NSHA in order to get a NHSA membership/card. How? or what method would you use to prove your a current/up to date & payed member of a Club on-line Instantly,where the system could be Checked that quickly... that Data would have to be entered into system by a treasurer or whom ever takes care of the records for "said" club

Not only that, but the State has it's acceptable procedure's to Registar a sled ( through an agent ) wether a store/dealer/"offical" member of a snowmobile club rep. acting as an "agent". to get the Dis-count on Registration of Sled's... sure is alot of work for $3

Winno's way work's & his registaring Agents are willing to work well with him...( not so sure of other agents around the State ) But like he mentioned..Time is of the essence. The BIG point is you save $30...Multiply that over 2-4 sleds and it's Gas money !!! or "free" reg on the 4th sled "Buy 3 get one free"

Edited August 27, 2010 by Pantera99

[BAC1954 1]

Why not fill out the paperwork when you recieve it from the club in the early fall and not have to wait till the secretary of the club gets to it. do it now and the club will have use of the money for trail projects. Also you can't forget the people in a panic that lost their cards or washed them.

[smallengineguy 88]

We have membership forms on the website, and the registration station does it with a credit card right over the phone too.

[WINNOCTURN 60]

Why not fill out the paperwork when you recieve it from the club in the early fall and not have to wait till the secretary of the club gets to it. do it now and the club will have use of the money for trail projects. Also you can't forget the people in a panic that lost their cards or washed them.

Here is a good reason to retun your applications early this year. I have had this posted on http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10700

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Why we ask for early Membership Renewals

I had posted the folowing earlier in the thread about Registration Fees had cone up this year. It becomes much more germane to this post.

With the lack of good snow and how fast what we had disappeared, registrations were very low this past season.

What does that mean? It means that funds for trail work and grooming this coming season will be cut back considerably. We live and die off of the money taken in through registrations.

Normally each club will submit on average 3 major construction project listed as P1, P2 and P3. These projects are rated numerically as to their importance. In most years the clubs will get the Grants for all 3 projects. This year because of the low number of registrations the Clubs were held to only their P1 grants.

The distribution ($$) for Equipment, ie New Groomers and other related equipment was limited. Clubs that had requested monies for both Trail Work and Equipment were given a choice of one or the other. If you went for the equipment you lost the Trail Work fund. Tough choice!

With the lack off Grant monies this means that the Clubs will need to "SELF FUND" some of these projects that are still necessary for good and safe riding on the trails.

So when you receive your Club renewal application don't let it sit on the kitchen counter till December 15th. Send it back ASAP and maybe check the box off for a donation to "TRAILS", no amount is to small.

With the Billions of dollars that Snowmobiling brings into the State maybe there should be some additional "STATE" funding for the Bureau of Trails and Fish and Game.

[whity 0]

Maybe it's just me. Why do people do this to themselves every season. You spend 8 to 10,000 on a sled but will not spend $25 $35 on club membership till we get snow. Or even register there sled! The way I look at it is, why not be ready for snow when it's falling?

[rivercat 119]

Here is a good reason to retun your applications early this year. I have had this posted on http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10700

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Why we ask for early Membership Renewals

I had posted the folowing earlier in the thread about Registration Fees had cone up this year. It becomes much more germane to this post.

With the lack of good snow and how fast what we had disappeared, registrations were very low this past season.

What does that mean? It means that funds for trail work and grooming this coming season will be cut back considerably. We live and die off of the money taken in through registrations.

Normally each club will submit on average 3 major construction project listed as P1, P2 and P3. These projects are rated numerically as to their importance. In most years the clubs will get the Grants for all 3 projects. This year because of the low number of registrations the Clubs were held to only their P1 grants.

The distribution ($$) for Equipment, ie New Groomers and other related equipment was limited. Clubs that had requested monies for both Trail Work and Equipment were given a choice of one or the other. If you went for the equipment you lost the Trail Work fund. Tough choice!

With the lack off Grant monies this means that the Clubs will need to "SELF FUND" some of these projects that are still necessary for good and safe riding on the trails.

So when you receive your Club renewal application don't let it sit on the kitchen counter till December 15th. Send it back ASAP and maybe check the box off for a donation to "TRAILS", no amount is to small.

With the Billions of dollars that Snowmobiling brings into the State maybe there should be some additional "STATE" funding for the Bureau of Trails and Fish and Game.

I could not agree more, the importance of joining clubs early this year,,, clubs are having to make some occasional difficult choices of how they will spread the money for improvements , and also what needs to be held in the club for equipment repairs, (all equipment repair is paid for by the club) A reserve is essential, In all due respect, I do not agree the State should be finding us "extra money" This is a time to see how far a dollar can be streached, rather than buying gravel for fill, can wood chips from the tree service guys, (check at the landfills) or sweepings from a local saw mill be aquired cheepr or free in your area? We have done this a few times on projects that were not funded we made out great!.

We just built a new bridge, rather than the usual pole barn spikes I checked the Fastenal site and found torks drive 6" screws on sale for $7.07 per box of 150 they ended up DONATING them to the club, they went in with 18volt cordless drills with ease. We used 4 FREE telephone poles for stringers, and also telephone poles for adbutments for carring the stringers, old junk decking from a torn out bridge for back walls whick were buried

I was able to get the conservation seed and hay donated for the areas that had been disturbed. I have even had landowners chip toward some projects in the past. sections of trail or bridges can have signs placed this bridge sponsored by "their name" I collected $750 from a sponsorer on one bridge. We also in exchange for a free heated meeting place (Alan's Resturant" have signs on the trail with directions to his resturant as well as other servises that are on our map, with a annually produced map and a up to date website we have 40 business pay a auunaul fee to advertise with us. Clubs need to be RESOURCEFUL money managers. Does any body have anything to barter for trails or trail supplies? Is it worth looking on craigs list for a late model pole saw, or chain saw to go in the groomer rather than a new one?

We have purchased two full sized groomers in the past few years while omitting one 16 year old Tucker 1000. We now have a 2002 Tucker Terra 1000 and a new Mogul Master Drag, and a late model Masey Marcel tractor conversion. Our total input from GIA is UNDER $50,000 for BOTH machines. RTP put $8300 toward the New $14,000 drag. We one sevral occasions have been called the "RICH CLUB" ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, I say,"It aint what you got, it's what you do with it"!

Finding a "talented cheepskate" (like me) to sit on your board may take a bit of searching. but they are out there!

Edited August 28, 2010 by rivercat

[rivercat 119]

Great idea Rivercat... think you mentioned it before someplace ... I take it your Talking about being a Member of NSHA membership & Card ???

A "Good" point would be the "Lesser Amount" of Paper work entailed, and go "Electronic"... But wouldn't this go against the theory of getting Registared Early ?.. or "New" to the sport individual's waiting for that 3-4 foot snow storm to spend money to registar their snowmobiles & join a club early ? The "real snowmobilers will regester as usual I am being selfish, as when the first snowstorm comes my, phone rings steady while I am trying to get out the door to go for a ride with my family

many Club's are doing Club Membership's on line already ... I maybe "wrong" (did I sat that?)but you have to be a member of a registared Snowmobile Club with NSHA in order to get a NHSA membership/card. How? or what method would you use to prove your a current/up to date & payed member of a Club on-line Instantly,where the system could be Checked that quickly... that Data would have to be entered into system by a treasurer or whom ever takes care of the records for "said" club NHSA needs to "develop a way other than holding membership cards :ransom" from the club to get them into "good standing" also because cards need to be mailed to the club the snail mail mamberships I see the electronic thing useful for ONLY those that are suddenly in a "hurry"

Not only that, but the State has it's acceptable procedure's to Registar a sled ( through an agent ) wether a store/dealer/"offical" member of a snowmobile club rep. acting as an "agent". to get the Dis-count on Registration of Sled's... sure is alot of work for $3 If the agent has more people coming in with their electronic membership complete it speeds the process at the counter by one full step

Winno's way work's & his registaring Agents are willing to work well with him...( not so sure of other agents around the State ) But like he mentioned..Time is of the essence. The BIG point is you save $30...Multiply that over 2-4 sleds and it's Gas money !!! or "free" reg on the 4th sled "Buy 3 get one free"

Edited August 28, 2010 by rivercat

[ckf 295]

NHSA needs to "develop a way other than holding membership cards :ransom" from the club to get them into "good standing" also because cards need to be mailed to the club the snail mail mamberships I see the electronic thing useful for ONLY those that are suddenly in a "hurry"

I'm not sure what you mean by the NHSA holding the membership cards ransom? Our club has never had a problem getting more cards from the NHSA when we need them. The cards usually arrive within a few days of the request. That said, we don't wait until we're out before we request more.

[rivercat 119]

I'm not sure what you mean by the NHSA holding the membership cards ransom? Our club has never had a problem getting more cards from the NHSA when we need them. The cards usually arrive within a few days of the request. That said, we don't wait until we're out before we request more.

NHSA doesnt send any cards to a club that is not "in good standing" ie; we had not picked up the mail at the PO BOX and just discovered that the club had not paid it's $30 membership fee in July, The cards are not mailed until that is done, there are other situations where a club may not be in "good standing" insurance payments etc. It is a concernthat a culb not in good standing could then be getting discounts for sledders when indeed the club is not a NHSA member club.

[ckf 295]

NHSA doesnt send any cards to a club that is not "in good standing" ie; we had not picked up the mail at the PO BOX and just discovered that the club had not paid it's $30 membership fee in July, The cards are not mailed until that is done, there are other situations where a club may not be in "good standing" insurance payments etc. It is a concernthat a culb not in good standing could then be getting discounts for sledders when indeed the club is not a NHSA member club.

How is it the NHSA's fault that the club doesn't check it's mailbox on a regular basis? If the person that is in charge of getting the mail isn't doing their job, find someone else to do it. I'm sure you've heard the expression, "Lack of planning on your part doesn't constitute an emergency on my part"

[rivercat 119]

How is it the NHSA's fault that the club doesn't check it's mailbox on a regular basis? If the person that is in charge of getting the mail isn't doing their job, find someone else to do it. I'm sure you've heard the expression, "Lack of planning on your part doesn't constitute an emergency on my part"

The RSA states that the discount applies to a person who is a MEMBER of a club that is in "good standing with NHSA,,,, there are a number of reasons ,, according to the office other than not getting the mail in the month of JULY ,,,, The reason I brought up the "instant membership" is to address the "occasional" circumstance when someone is on a "chomp" to get a membership and registration NOW,,when the person(s) from a given club are not available to get the NHSA card on a moments noticce,,,, this "idea" is not about changing the existing system, it's about "augmenting" it. As one of the "more active" members of my club, I get any call about ANY thing pertaining to our club, and I know I am not ALONE

[jne1469 0]

I always try to join and register in late Sept or early Oct. I figure that even if it doesn't snow the club can use the money and I won't get caught not ready when the snow does fly. I am luck that I can join my club (SNHSS)and register my sled there at the same time! I have always wondered why a club that could use the money would not offer a small dicount to members if they joined/rejoined by Sept 15th or Oct 1st or some other date. If a club could get more members to join early it would make life easier for the member that wants to register their sled(s) befor the snow falls and make life easier for the club that has to process the paperwork and the club would have money available earlier in the season for trail maintenance, or equipment or whatever. An added benefit might be that members would start thinking about their club earlier in the season and may be more likely to volunteer for work parties.

I am not sure if this makes any sense or not?

Jason

[Pantera99 0]

I always try to join and register in late Sept or early Oct. I figure that even if it doesn't snow the club can use the money and I won't get caught not ready when the snow does fly. I am luck that I can join my club (SNHSS)and register my sled there at the same time! I have always wondered why a club that could use the money would not offer a small dicount to members if they joined/rejoined by Sept 15th or Oct 1st or some other date. If a club could get more members to join early it would make life easier for the member that wants to register their sled(s) befor the snow falls and make life easier for the club that has to process the paperwork and the club would have money available earlier in the season for trail maintenance, or equipment or whatever. An added benefit might be that members would start thinking about their club earlier in the season and may be more likely to volunteer for work parties.

I am not sure if this makes any sense or not?

Jason

Much of what you said makes sense... Over several years' the club had very dedicated individual's whom in my opinion, go out of their way to make the Club Stronger $ Better for the sake of other's to enjoy the area riding...like "all the comfort's of home". Even for any rider, riding our system to stop in and be welcomed.

The registration of sled's was an added "perk" for convience ( we also collected the $3 fee per registraion as an agent) We had several Agent's/powersport buis. carrying our club membership's to fill out which helps Snowmobilers (Save $$$) as Stated. What you "donate" to join a club goes direct to club while saving on the discount end... Win-Win.

As a Matter of fact...when our club's booth is run at events( most often than not ) You can New/initially Join or re-join the Club and do your sled registrations at same time provided you have old reg or bill of sale w/ vin# & your drivers license of owner of sled( very important )...

For the NHSA topic... The Club takes care of that also..just a quick paper with a couple line's while they are taking care of sled reg... The Club sends paperwork it back to NHSA, and the Club give's you your card right there. (as long as they didn't run out) usually the club name is on card also.

Edited August 31, 2010 by Pantera99

[ckf 295]

I really don't see a need for a internet based instant membership card. The costs of implementing such a program isn't worth the cost for those few people that don't plan ahead. As several people on this board have said, it's time to buckle down and conserve funds.

[rivercat 119]

I really don't see a need for a internet based instant membership card. The costs of implementing such a program isn't worth the cost for those few people that don't plan ahead. As several people on this board have said, it's time to buckle down and conserve funds.

Didn't cost a penny to set up ,,,,,,,, if a member joins our club, because we are a nonprofit, their is a small chage "fee" taken at the time of the $30 transaction $1.17 to be exact, this is taken from his $30 transaction to the club (from the club) the funds are directly deposited into an account with will then flow electronicly to our checking or savings accts.

You say it's time to buckle down and conserve funds,,,,,, one more way to look at it is if a member is joining our club and has his credit card in hand is he MAYBE a tiny bit more likely to say "I'll toss a donation in as well" I KNOW what came in with donations last year, and we will watch with interest because we do have the online membership ALREADY working and it is getting used. now we will be able to compare the two! At this moment twice the members have joined online with 50% making a donation online. we are talking small #s but it is how it has begun!

As snowmobilers , and club directors, as well as members of NHSA, I find it important to be a "visionary" where will we be in 5 years? 10 years, What do we need to be thinking of to "protect" our sport, what could the wrong governor do with DRED, BOT? Look how far life has advanced in the last 10 years, what does our future hold both good and bad? look for one moment at the vision Walt Disney had when he tried to buy a swamp in the middle of Florida, who could have thought?

Edited September 1, 2010 by rivercat

[Skip 262]

I really don't see a need for a internet based instant membership card. The costs of implementing such a program isn't worth the cost for those few people that don't plan ahead. As several people on this board have said, it's time to buckle down and conserve funds.

I agree with you 100% John.

This is a perfect example, in my opinion, of that old saying: "...an answer in search of a problem...".

No matter what is proposed, a certain percentage of riders will not ride or register until the last possible moment, if at all. Devising an instantaneous way to reward that behavior could have an opposite effect, that being encouraging more people to not register and hence join a club until the last minute, as we would easily provide them a mechanism rewarding that behavior.

We need to concentrate, on a club by club basis, ways to encourage people to want to join a club(s) at the very beginning of the season, regardless of perceived riding conditions, to get cash into the clubs coffers as early as possible.

We also need to remember that joining a club and registering a sled are two different issues. The club must exist every year, regardless if the member registers a sled or not. Also, there is no reason that a Club can't market itself to non sledders in their area who use the club's trails in the winters....like mushers, snow shoers and cross country skiers.

Obviously the registration process will evolve and there likely is some type of internet based or paperless application expansion in the future. Many clubs are well down this road already. I say let's continue to let it evolve at the club level while at the State level we concentrate on all the initiatives we are already pursuing! I just don't see the outcry coming from the clubs on this issue...most are concentrating on survival, trail preparation and still doing a good job at member retention without this proposal in place.

[ckf 295]

I guess I don't understand what you are proposing. I thought you wanted to do a statewide database system that collected members money and allowed them to print the card right then. From your above post it sounds like a PayPal setup for membership. OVSC has offered PayPal membership for a few years now.

[rivercat 119]

Remember the "visionary" example I made on my prior post? ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Lets disect our current system for just a moment for a "test"

#1 I currently fill out an app and mail it to a club (and wait a few day while a volunteer mails my membership card/information to me by snail mail)

#2 The club you joined has it's volunteer sending membership numbers to NHSA on a ongoing basis with $10 for each member that joined the club.

#3 NHSA MANUALLY enters the information of 30,000 members into their computer (which all non renewing members are "dumped" the following year).

Now lets try to "invision"

#1 I go to the NHSA website and JOIN NHSA (online) In the process of joining NHSA I chose any club(s) that I wish to be a member of and make my credit or debit card payment, As I am typing on my keyboard the data is going directly to NHSA's data base. (no re-entry needed) I print my NHSA "card" and my "club voucher" (this allows me to go register my sled(s)

#2 NHSA's (paid staff) sends a check monthly with a membership "statement" to each club for their new memberships POSSIBLY with the capibility of software, the club membership chairperson could access the NHSA website to view and print THEIR own clubs membership lists.

THIS IS PURELY CONCEPTUAL,,,,,,, However NYSSA New York State Snowmobile association is pretty much doing this! ,,,,,check their site!

We live in a age where data seems so important,, yet, at times "data management" is the least productive part of any function.

[rivercat 119]

I guess I don't understand what you are proposing. I thought you wanted to do a statewide database system that collected members money and allowed them to print the card right then. From your above post it sounds like a PayPal setup for membership. OVSC has offered PayPal membership for a few years now.

Yes John for this year I simply wanted to be able to allow MY members the option of taking their paypal reciept to a dealer (agent) and having the dealer recognise the paypal reciept as "good enough" to allow the discount for decals, this would be club level,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,HOWEVER my post above this one is looking down the road a bit,,,

VERY SORRY for the confusion , but if you re read my opening post hopefully it will make sense

Edited September 1, 2010 by rivercat

[Pantera99 0]

I think they get the point, Rivercat... It's the Conception of it all happening at the NHSA level really... Many Club's like mentioned already are doing the on-line club membership's..and with-in club's, NHSA card's most likely they have on hand to issue at that time.

We know you meant for "Emergencies", last minute Registrations ( to save the $30. ) or I can see a Newbie buying their 1st Sled and having that smooth transaction for the Enjoyable weekend of Fresh Snow... You don't have to belong to a Club or NHSA to reg a sled !!! they can still Ride...

The Electronic "age" wont be to far behind at the State level, the public will push it...They know it saves time, money & paper.

one concept that I think it would be great for, is a "Anyonomous Gift" NHSA membership to someone else or at the "Club Level" paid Membership...Many folk's this past year or 2, just couldn't justify spending money on the club they have belonged to for years or snowmobile registration's... Money was tight. So, they waited till the snow flew. They were just being Practical in expenditure's.

Something many club's wish for is the "EARLY" membership...I have tended lately, any Membership a club recieve's at any time should be "Thankful"... Sometimes project's just need to be placed on a back burner for the "next season" it's called a Plan...