33 replies to this topic

[steviep]

Skip, on 06 December 2010 - 10:26 AM, said:

While your style signs may work well for your area, many of our landowners (especially those abutting the WMNF) would never tolerate such a design.

Additionally the forest service style signs are extremely easy to read as you slow appropriately (or stop) as you pass through the intersections where they are posted.

And thank you once again Joe for volunteering to build these signs...the compliments keep coming in and the trails are not even open yet!

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the speed limit through trail jct's quite a bit slower

[Rad8165]

steviep, on 06 December 2010 - 09:29 PM, said:

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the speed limit through trail jct's quite a bit slower

Do you ride in NH????? You don't slow down!!!!!! I really think the point to be made here!!! Someone took the time to make what they were told too! Did a very nice job of it!!!!!!!! They seem to be undercut about well maybe should of done this,,, You know what/?????? That guy put his time in makeing the signs,,Did a GREAT JOB!!!! THANK YOU< FOR YOUR TIME!!!!!!!!

[rivercat]

Skip, on 06 December 2010 - 10:26 AM, said:

While your style signs may work well for your area, many of our landowners (especially those abutting the WMNF) would never tolerate such a design.

Additionally the forest service style signs are extremely easy to read as you slow appropriately (or stop) as you pass through the intersections where they are posted.

And thank you once again Joe for volunteering to build these signs...the compliments keep coming in and the trails are not even open yet!

Skip Don't tell me the "tree huggers" cool aide has been handed to you,,,,,

I have to question,,,, how many landowners REALLY ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,"would never tolerate such a design."
#1 Is it a "fashon contest?
#2 Are trai junctions/ visible from ANYONES livingroom window? (how "obtrusive" can a 18"x24" sign be in the middle of "nowhere"
#3 Isn't more information including distance to next intersection and GPS MORE inportant than a "pleasing" color/style to the landowner/wildlife? (function before "beauty")
#4 Here in midstate NH, Concord /Boscawen/Webster we have nearly 40 intersections on 40 seperate landowners property Including State, municipal and private land,,,, one landowner paid $5,000,000 for his land (yes 5 MILLION),,, he is very pleased with our signs and allowed them to stay up all summer. The Concord Conservation Comission has welcomed our signs as well.
I was in the NH BOT office and recieved acolades for the "great signs"from one of the staff at the Bureau who was doing a "workshop" within our trail network
#5 walking in the dark the reflectorized sign will show up several hundred feet away with a "tiny" pen light (a great SAFETY feature)
#6 Anyone who has ever driven auto on a NH highway, is farmiliar with the "information color" ( this includes everyone even hikers!)
#7 It doesnt take a "special" machine to make them

I will confess I had one irrate landowner,,,,, he felt the steel post could be "bad" for the land and asked that we install a 4x4 wood post loaded with "chemicals" and re-attach our "intolerable" blue signs.
The green posts are a bit "loud" but with the donated pipe and painting I was not given a choice of color,, besides it's almost the "cat" green!

Our "design" was derived from SEVEN snowmobilers who brought together their riding experences from YELLOWSTONE, CANADA, MAINE, and NY as well as the entire State of NH, Each of the seven had been riding between 20-30 years. "Melting" the prospective of each was a interesting experence, in a club meting we had to do a "virtual approach to each intersection to attain the most logicl information to be placed on each of the three signs , (depending on direction of approach),,,, The meetings /hrs were endless,,, and we still have a few to "fix"

I will REPEAT ,,,, the northern wood signs are "beautiful" the intersections are well marked,,, Larry G and the whole gang do an amazing job!! ANY well marked intersection is a "beautiful thing",,,,

Edited by rivercat, 07 December 2010 - 02:20 AM.

[ckf]

rivercat, on 07 December 2010 - 01:49 AM, said:

Skip Don't tell me the "tree huggers" cool aide has been handed to you,,,,,

I have to question,,,, how many landowners REALLY ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,"would never tolerate such a design."
#1 Is it a "fashon contest?
#2 Are trai junctions/ visible from ANYONES livingroom window? (how "obtrusive" can a 18"x24" sign be in the middle of "nowhere"
#3 Isn't more information including distance to next intersection and GPS MORE inportant than a "pleasing" color/style to the landowner/wildlife? (function before "beauty")
#4 Here in midstate NH, Concord /Boscawen/Webster we have nearly 40 intersections on 40 seperate landowners property Including State, municipal and private land,,,, one landowner paid $5,000,000 for his land (yes 5 MILLION),,, he is very pleased with our signs and allowed them to stay up all summer. The Concord Conservation Comission has welcomed our signs as well.
I was in the NH BOT office and recieved acolades for the "great signs"from one of the staff at the Bureau who was doing a "workshop" within our trail network
#5 walking in the dark the reflectorized sign will show up several hundred feet away with a "tiny" pen light (a great SAFETY feature)
#6 Anyone who has ever driven auto on a NH highway, is farmiliar with the "information color" ( this includes everyone even hikers!)
#7 It doesnt take a "special" machine to make them

I will confess I had one irrate landowner,,,,, he felt the steel post could be "bad" for the land and asked that we install a 4x4 wood post loaded with "chemicals" and re-attach our "intolerable" blue signs.
The green posts are a bit "loud" but with the donated pipe and painting I was not given a choice of color,, besides it's almost the "cat" green!

Our "design" was derived from SEVEN snowmobilers who brought together their riding experences from YELLOWSTONE, CANADA, MAINE, and NY as well as the entire State of NH, Each of the seven had been riding between 20-30 years. "Melting" the prospective of each was a interesting experence, in a club meting we had to do a "virtual approach to each intersection to attain the most logicl information to be placed on each of the three signs , (depending on direction of approach),,,, The meetings /hrs were endless,,, and we still have a few to "fix"

I will REPEAT ,,,, the northern wood signs are "beautiful" the intersections are well marked,,, Larry G and the whole gang do an amazing job!! ANY well marked intersection is a "beautiful thing",,,,

ON the bold....we have several landowners that wouldn't tolerate a flashy sign. We are fortunate that they even allow us on their property. One of our landowners makes the signs for us to use on their property. One of our trails in the White Mountain National Forest is only a stones throw away for the wilderness zone.

Personally I like your clubs signs, they just wouldn't fly with some of our landowners

[Skip]

ckf, on 07 December 2010 - 07:54 AM, said:

ON the bold....we have several landowners that wouldn't tolerate a flashy sign. We are fortunate that they even allow us on their property. One of our landowners makes the signs for us to use on their property. One of our trails in the White Mountain National Forest is only a stones throw away for the wilderness zone.

Personally I like your clubs signs, they just wouldn't fly with some of our landowners

Well said John.

But really, what do you know....I mean you've only been dealing with the local community for four decades......

[Skip]

steviep, on 06 December 2010 - 09:29 PM, said:

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the speed limit through trail jct's quite a bit slower

You are correct Steve....10 MPH at trail junctions...... I'll deputize you and have you help teach the class this weekend.....

[AUTOMOVER]

Why does every thread for the good have to turn into a pissing match?

[rivercat]

Skip, on 07 December 2010 - 08:06 AM, said:

Well said John.

But really, what do you know....I mean you've only been dealing with the local community for four decades......

Not sure what your trying to say here Skip,,,,,

Four decades ago signage was for the most part nonexistant,,,
Four decades ago GPS was nonexistant,,,
Four decades ago NO ONE was riding 300 miles a day,,,, (sleds had to be repaired every 100 miles,,, lol)


Four decades ago I had begun to clear some trails
Four decades ago I was on my SECOND SLED!

Let's try to remember,,,, the sport of snowmobiling has "morphed" in the last FOUR YEARS,,,,,,,,,,, It will continue to morph and we must all try to keep up.
By thinking OUTSIDE of the "box" we all have a chance tol keep the sport ALIVE, HEALTHY, AND GROWING.

I have to wonder if a "blue" sign was attached to a PT 4x4 that was stained or painted how many people"up north" would still feel they are "TOO INTOLERABLE"

The policy of the NHBOT as I understand is that the prefered post is indeed a 4x4 wood post (for safety reasons) I "think" in case a sledder hit one was the rational,,,,,,, TLTD has used a 2" painted steel THINWALL pipe,, We used te pipe for cost and speed of installation , we may change them out at some point,,
Do we have any "crash dummies who want to give each a try?
The pipes have been a dream to pound in and we devised a way to keep people from "spinning' them around tho we have not "spin proofed" them yet!

Edited by rivercat, 07 December 2010 - 09:23 AM.

[rivercat]

AUTOMOVER, on 07 December 2010 - 09:21 AM, said:

Why does every thread for the good have to turn into a pissing match?

Interesting question?????????????????

[RayC]

rivercat, on 07 December 2010 - 09:28 AM, said:

Why does every thread for the good have to turn into a pissing match?


Interesting question?????????????????

There is NO contest.
Joe... you did a nice job for your area and rivercat did a nice job in his area.
When I get to both areas i will ride accordingly to INFO posted.
I ....and ....me perfer MORE info as I travel farther because it helps with less STOPS from taking out the map in all weather conditions.
Night time travel will be easy to spot at night.
There is no p. m.
....

[steviep]

I think they are all good and if someone in your club wants to volenteer to make them all the better.
Here is what we are doing, before installing, We have been making laminated trail info signs for the arrows. The plywwod was donated from a local buesness.

[Skip]

steviep, on 07 December 2010 - 06:55 PM, said:

I think they are all good and if someone in your club wants to volenteer to make them all the better.
Here is what we are doing, before installing, We have been making laminated trail info signs for the arrows. The plywwod was donated from a local buesness.
trail jct.jpg

Sounds great Steve...can't wait to see them this winter..........

[ckf]

Another intersection is done.

[Skip]

Awesome !